Propane injection (was Nitrus injectors (was Hydrothermal

Tue Jun 16 04:20:07 GMT 1998

On Mon, 15 Jun 1998 13:55:46 +1000 Peter Jaramaz
<pjaramaz at ingenico.com.au> writes:
>A problem (how much of a problem I'm not here to argue) with LPG being 
>gaseous is that the gas displaces air as opposed to normal fuel which is

>atomised and displace relatively little air.

I did some calculations.  A stoich mixture of propane and air (assuming
about 20% O2) is around 35:1 or 40:1.  That means that the propane
displaces 2.5% to 3% (roughly) of the air.  I believe that the resultant
mixture has somewhat less thermal energy than a similar amount of
air/gasoline mixture.

>
>Also, current LPG metering systems are poor, often consisting of just a 
>basic air/gas mixer with a A/F adjustment, some having provision for
idle 
>A/F as well.

That's why I want to go with injecters.  My Holley system does an
impeccible job of metering the fuel out.  I would like to do that with
propane or methane.

>
>IMHO, if you could inject gas as an atomised liquid, with proper ECM
style 
>control, you would make a very hard to resist package, even for those
not 
>concerned with economy, emmissions etc.

I was thinking about injecting it as a liquid.  There would be a lot of
heat absorbed as the liquid vaporizes.  This would cool down the intake
air/fuel mixture.  Very likely, the denser mixture would result in more
power simply because you can stuff more of it into the cylinders.

For you turbo fans:  Imagine injecting a carefully metered amount just
downstream of the compresser.  There was a thread about using water
injection to cool the intake.  Imagine injecting something that is
esentially a fefrigerant.

I wanted to do some calculations before bringing it up, but since Peter
mentioned it...

I must have been asleep in a couple of days in thermodynamics class, but
I am need to be able to do some calculations.  If you compress an ideal
gas by a specific ratio and without any heat going into or out of the
gas, what will be the resultant pressure and temperature.

P1 * T1 / V1 = P2 * T2 / V2

I know the change in volume, but that leaves me with two dependant
variables.  I need another equation (and probablly a constant).  I think
that it has something to do with the specific heat capacity of the gas.

This information would also be useful for calculating the compression
ratio of an engine based on the results of a compression check.

What is the latent heat of vaporization of propane?  (For that matter,
what is its chemical formula?  C3H8?  C4H10?)

What I want to figure out is the mass density of the air/propane mixture
if you mix enough liquid propane with a volume of air to create a stoich
mixture.

As a warmup exercise, I want to calculate the amount of cooling and the
resultant mass density of a methane/air mixture if you inject enough
compressed methane (about 1000 PSI) into the air to create a stoich
mixture.  The trouble is that I am missing one equation, my physics and
chem books are buried in the shed, and I forgot a couple of the necessary
constants (such as the atomic mass of nitrogen).

Ray Drouillard

>
>PJ
>
>----------
>From: 	Dave Balfour
>Sent: 	Monday, June 15, 1998 10:47 AM
>To: 	diy_efi at efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu
>Subject: 	Re: Nitrus injectors (was Hydrothermal Biomass-Fueled 
>Engines)
>
>I wouldnt think that efi would be a real big advantage on lpg. The
>stuff is already gaseous and wont fall out of mixture like gasoline
>or diesel. dave balfour
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Matthew Harding <mharding at qonline.com.au>
>To: diy_efi at efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu
><diy_efi at efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu>
>Date: Sunday, June 14, 1998 7:38 AM
>Subject: Re: Nitrus injectors (was Hydrothermal Biomass-Fueled
>Engines)
>
>
>>There was something in a motor magazine recently about someone
>protoyping a
>>LPG injection system... with special purpose built injectors...
>would these
>>bo better for what you want?
>>
>>some one else in aus might know more about it, I just remember
>flicking
>>past it at the newsagent one day  :(
>>Matthew Harding
>>---------------
>>
>>reply to any of these....
>>
>>mharding at qonline.com.au
>>bernie at ronscomputers.com.au
>>bernie at browse-cafe.com.au
>>
>
>
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>
>
>

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