Im going CRAZY, WOT tuning is being a bastard! Runningoutoffuel

[olbap]

Yeah, timing isnt the problem, ive burned a chip with 0 spark retard..
though i do get an occasional 43 when it does go lean and goes into
precautionary retard.

lemme get off my rear and take it for a spin or two with closed loop disabled.

Pablo




At 04:06 PM 5/25/00 -0400, you wrote:
>does it have a knock sensor??  it could be pulling out alot of timing too..
>though i'm not familiar with tbi....
>i'm TPIguy not TBIguy <grin>
>
>Mike Rolica
>Plant A
>Meridian Magnesium Products
>Strathroy
>(519)-245-4040 Ext. 265
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From:	olbap [SMTP:olbap at mail.mia.bellsouth.net]
>> Sent:	Thursday, May 25, 2000 3:15 PM
>> To:	gmecm at diy-efi.org
>> Subject:	RE: Im going CRAZY, WOT tuning is being a bastard!
>> Runningoutoffuel
>> 
>> Mike, 
>> This is exactly what I just did, just disabled closed loop. Havent tested
>> it
>> yet. We'll see what happens, if it runs the same at wot all the time and
>> as
>> good as that first time yesterday ill be as giddy as a school girl
>> 
>> 
>> Len, 
>> any reason I should stay down so low on the factory TBI injectors? Ive
>> searched the archives and seen numerous posts stating that the factory GM
>> injectors can take alot more than that, something like 70 psi if memory
>> serves me.
>> Besides, if i ran these injectors at 13 psi i dont think they would
>> support
>> beyond 200 hp.
>> 
>> 
>> Pablo
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> At 02:31 PM 5/25/00 -0400, you wrote:
>> >I was once at a site that had a lot of info on this subject.
>> >Also for me in my 165 now 730 tpi in an s15 ecm, had the same problem
>> while
>> >going to the track.
>> >when the car was in limp mode from disconnecting the maf, it ran
>> consistant
>> >but slower.  When i transfered over to the 730, it too had the same
>> problem.
>> >Bruce suggested i disable closed loop and run in open and tune it until
>> it
>> >was bang on.
>> >when forced in open i ran consistant times that were as fast as my first
>> >times.  thru tuning i eventually droped .5 sec of the et.
>> >now i'm working on closed loop  but have not been to the track to test
>> the
>> >latest bin.. will be tomorrow though.
>> >you should also mount a fuel pres guage that you can see while driving
>> as
>> >close to the injectors as possible.
>> >
>> >my 5cents worth canadian (2 cents american :)
>> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> From:	olbap [SMTP:olbap at mail.mia.bellsouth.net]
>> >> Sent:	Thursday, May 25, 2000 12:43 PM
>> >> To:	gmecm at diy-efi.org
>> >> Subject:	Re: Im going CRAZY, WOT tuning is being a bastard! Running
>> >> outoffuel
>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> It runs strongest at about .9v, currently thats dropping down to very
>> low
>> >> .8's and high .7s wot.. it runs absolutely horrible too, and im getting
>> >> pretty bad knock when it happens.
>> >> 
>> >> The more I think about it the more im starting to think heat is causing
>> >> it.
>> >> Not coolant temperature but just some automotive component heat
>> soaking.
>> >> The reason I believe this is because the last time I went to the track,
>> it
>> >> did the same thing. I issumed it was bad injectors because the track is
>> >> 150
>> >> miles away. I figured the ecm would have learned pretty much all there
>> was
>> >> to learn. I ran my fastest time on my first run, each run was
>> >> progressively
>> >> slower and slower and when i finally decided to look at my O2 it was
>> down
>> >> at
>> >> .4 - .5 wot at the end of the night!
>> >> Yes, i have kept copies of each bin as i go and have taken mental
>> notes.
>> >> As
>> >> I said before, i think my part throttle is very close to being right.
>> >> 
>> >> Pablo
>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> 
>> >> At 08:08 AM 5/25/00 EDT, you wrote:
>> >> >Pablo,
>> >> >you didn't say what your O2 readings are.  When chip tuning, always
>> >> >take notes, and keep copies of each bin as you go, so you can "go
>> back".
>> >> >If you think the ECM's learning curve is fighting you, kill the power
>> >> >to the ECM and make another test run.. You didn't mention what you 
>> >> >are using to gather data, but I would think the integrator numbers
>> should
>> >> >help you tun the fuel...
>> >> >MV
>> >> >
>> >> >> 
>> >> >>  I start tuning WOT this morning, friend (or shall i say carbureted
>> >> arch
>> >> >>  nemesis) comes by, first chip it runs very strong.. lean past  4200
>> >> but 
>> >> >very
>> >> >>  strong nonetheless,  he thinks  i might give him a run finally...
>> he
>> >> leaves
>> >> >>  afterwards.
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  So, I go into my AFR- WOT table.. drop it down some at 4800   
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  Go for a spin again.. runs much better.. still lean a bit on top
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  Repeat step two
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  Go for spin again, seems like maybe (this is a shot inthe dark)
>> >> perhaps my
>> >> >>  part throttle isnt as good as i thought, on therich side, and the
>> ecm
>> >> is
>> >> >>  leaning me out across the board
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  Ok, ill just keep richening it up till its beyond the scope of
>> >> adjustment i
>> >> >>  figure (yeah im real half assed about things, i just want it to be
>> >> fast at
>> >> >>  wot at this point)
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  Repeat step two.. several times
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  repeat thepart about me going lean several times.. yet getting
>> worse
>> >> >>  andworse each time... down to about 3800 rpms its pretty much done.
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  Ok, time to go crazy, so i start making big changes in the AFR and
>> FL2
>> >> just
>> >> >>  to make it  bird killing, rear bumper blackening, plug fouling rich
>> >> (id
>> >> >>  rather work down than up)
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  ok, it only makes itBARELY better than what it was
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  at this point, i think a geo metro can beat me
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  
>> >> >>  desperate times call for desperate measures so i repeat the bird
>> >> killing,
>> >> >>  plug fouling step
>> >>
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