[Gmecm] Looking for (turbo) specs - 97 to 99 Chevy diesel 2500HD pickup...

Mon Feb 13 01:36:15 UTC 2012

David -

As a matter of comparison.  A few months ago I tuned a customer's 2000
Corvette and we used two Holset HX35 turbos from a Cummins Diesel equipped
98-99 Dodge Ram truck.  The engine in the Vette was a custom blend of LS
components:  LS2 block w/ ERL 1" deck plates with 4.2" sleeves, 4.5" stroke
Callies crank (500 ci) 8.2L, LS7 heads, LS7 Intake, big Comp Cams Hyd
Roller, "wrapped" headers, and ARP bolts everywhere.

While on the dyno we were able to play with the boost a little to see what
we could get, and we were able to get a full 30 psi of boost!  The customer
was planning for 10-15 psi boost to achieve 800 HP at the Rear Wheels and we
were able to accomplish that with only 10 psi.  Obviously, the massive
engine already put out decent power levels, so 10 psi was all that was
needed to reach 800 HP @ 5600 RPM, 787 lb-ft @ 5200 RPM.

I am not sure how the Holset turbo compares to the GM turbo, so I can't
really comment on that.

As you consider using a Diesel turbo on your 3.8L V6, I thought this would
be good food for thought.  All things considered relative to the turbo
specs, the main thing is that you want to make sure the turbine is a good
match for the exhaust output from the V6 engine.  Of course you probably
already know that if the turbo is too big, you will only see the power
coming "in," late in the RPM band and that won't be any fun for the street.
If the turbo matches well to your engine then you should see boost coming in
between 2000 and 2500 RPM.  It is difficult to obtain any reasonable spec
sheet for any factory turbocharger.

Look into what has been done on the Buick Grand National turbo V6 cars from
1984 - 1987.  But, GM did bring the mighty turbo 3.8L V6 back in the 1989
Pontiac Trans Am (EPROM BCC: APXB).

GM also turbocharged the 3.1 V6 in the 1989 & 1990 W-body Grand Prix (EPROM
BCC: AUFR).

Hope this helps.

  David Johnson

From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On Behalf
Of David Allen
Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2012 5:45 PM
To: Rick McLeod; GM-ECM
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Looking for (turbo) specs - 97 to 99 Chevy diesel
2500HD pickup...

Yes, there's a 'rule of thumb' I have found to be true. If you have a turbo
for a 'stock' diesel engine of "x" horsepower, it will support about "2x"
horsepower on a gas engine.

This is mainly because a diesel uses a much higher flow of air per HP
(because not all the air is burned - much goes out the exhaust).

The engine is question is a 3.8L engine. I have boosted 2 of them, one
stocker (used a T3 with .48 AR exh housing) which has very strong low-end
power but runs out of steam a little before redline. Other one is modified
engine, with a Turbonetics GTK450 that is closer to this Chevy diesel turbo
in size. With ported heads, aftermarket camshaft and re-tune it will spool
this turbo at about 2500 RPM and make nearly 20 PSI and 435+ HP by redline.

For this project we need something in between the little T3 and the GTK450.
I would like to see this diesel turbo in-person and take some measurements
on it. I have a feeling the compressor will be about right, but as you say -
the exhaust side will be way too big.

Thanks again for all the info!

David

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Rick McLeod <mailto:dunvegan at sbcglobal.net>  

To: David Allen <mailto:davida1 at hiwaay.net>  ; gmecm
<mailto:gmecm at diy-efi.org>  

Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2012 6:29 PM

Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Looking for specs - 97 to 99 Chevy diesel 2500HD
pickup...

my 'gut' feel based on knowing what I do about diesel and gas turbo
applications, it's likely way big for your use - my rational:

gas is usually much lower boost level than is diesel

the displacement (meaning cylinder volume to fill) is nearly 2X what I
believe your'e looking at - I believe your targeting a 3ish litre and this
hog is targeted to a nearly 7 ish litre

the volume/velocity of air to spin it up would most likely not allow it to
spool as necessary to develop low end torque, but might be great at high rpm
to overcome intake friction or a poor intake path

I'd be interested in what you find and do, keep us educated as you go

-rick

  _____  

From: David Allen <davida1 at hiwaay.net>
To: Aaron <aaron at creativeoverdrive.com>; GM-ECM <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sun, February 12, 2012 6:15:13 PM
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Looking for specs - 97 to 99 Chevy diesel 2500HD
pickup...

Thank you for the information!!!
Will look into that as time allows.
David

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Aaron" <aaron at creativeoverdrive.com>
To: "'David Allen'" <davida1 at hiwaay.net>
Sent: Sunday, February 12, 2012 2:54 PM
Subject: RE: [Gmecm] Looking for specs - 97 to 99 Chevy diesel 2500HD 
pickup...

>I can look it up for you.
> What Spec are you looking for?
> I assume you mean turbo, I didn't find any maps or diameter on a quick
> search.
> Here are some part numbers and such to help your searching from behind the
> great fire wall.
>
> 6.5L GM Specs:
> Manufacturer:
> Detroit Diesel
>
> Production Years:
> 1992-2000. Continued use in military applications by AM General.
>
> Applications:
> Chevrolet/GMC: Tahoe, Yukon, Suburban, C/K pickups, 2500 & 3500 trucks. AM
> General: Hummer & HMMWV
>
> Configuration:
> V-8
>
> Block/Head Material:
> cast iron block, cast iron heads
>
> Displacement:
> 395 cubic inches, 6.5 L
>
> Compression:
> 18:1 - 21.3:1 depending on year & application
>
> Bore:
> 4.06 inches
>
> Stroke:
> 3.82 inches
>
> Injection:
> IDI (indirect injection)
>
> Aspiration:
> Turbocharged & naturally asprirated versions available.
>
> Max Engine Speed:
> 3,400 RPM
>
> Horsepower:
> Introductory: 180 HP @ 3,400 RPM
> Peak: 215 HP @ 3,200 RPM
>
> Torque:
> Introductory: 360 HP @ 1,700 RPM
> Peak: 440 lb-ft. @ 1,800 RPM
>
> Reputation:
> Outperformed by Dodge & Ford. Capable of respectable fuel economy. 
> Somewhat
> problematic depending on version of engine.
>
> Additional 6.5L Information:
>
> . Offered in naturally aspirated & turbocharged versions.
>
> . The 6.5L was replaced by the Duramax 6600 (6.6 L).
>
> . AM General now manufacturers and uses the 6.5 L diesel in their military
> HMMWV (now called the 6500 Optimizer).
>
> . Common problems with the 6.5L included cracks in the main caps &
> crankshaft failures due to aging/fatigue of the harmonic balancer. Glow
> plugs are prone to failure (causes hard starting), overheating issues in 
> the
> 1988-1998 style trucks (can lead to cracked cylinder heads).
>
> 6.5L GM Engine Versions:
>
> . L49: Naturally aspirated.
>
> . L56: Turbocharged. Emissions controlled (EGR & catalytic converters). 
> Used
> in all light duty 1/2 & 3/4 ton trucks.
>
> . L57: Naturally Aspirated. HO or heavy duty.
>
> . L65: Turbocharged. Used in all heavy duty 3/4 & 1 ton trucks.
>
> . LQM: 175 HP
>
> . LQN: 190 HP
>
> . "Fuel Miser": 120 HP, 260 lb-ft. torque. Optional in P-trucks (delivery
> trucks).
>
> =---------------------
> http://www.thedieselpage.com/finale.htm
>
> The maximum boost pressure for all stock 6.5 diesels is about 7 psi, and 
> the
> stock 6.5 trucks run without an intercooler. The new pistons, intercooler
> and factory GM-8 turbo allowed us to safely run competitive levels of 
> boost
> pressure.
>
> -------------------------
>
http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?s=19a365c063d5c5db9270a7431c
> 5a5337&t=435415
>
> It will depend on the load on the engine. For the most part, you'll see a
> max sustained of about 7-10 pounds. May hit 12 under high load.
> ----------------------
> http://www.hdiesel.com/product.asp?id=77
> Year Range Part Number
>
> 1991-1992 CK GM1 Rebuilt / Exchange Turbo  10183934 or 12515808
> 1993 CK GM3 Rebuilt / Exchange Turbo  10226226 or 12521577
> 1993-1994 CK GM4 Rebuilt / Exchange Turbo  10154652 or 12512988
> 1995-1998 CK GM5 Rebuilt / Exchange Turbo  12552738 or 12530336(use GM8)
> 1996-2000 Van GM6 Rebuilt / Exchange Turbo 10241690 or 12530339
> 1997-2000 CK GM8 Rebuilt / Exchange Turbo  12530339 or 12556124
> ------------------------
> http://www.turborepair.com/index.php?option=com_content
<http://www.turborepair.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=180
&> &view=article&id=180&
> Itemid=142
>
> .1992 GM-1, production number 6T-522, GM PN 10183934, pottergate spring
> loaded wastegate
> .1993, GM-3, production number 6T-522, GM PN 10226226, Added bosses for
> straps on compressor housing
> .1994, GM-2, production number 6T-552, GM PN 10154686, Long exhaust elbow
> .1995, GM-4, production number 6T-550, GM PN 10154652, vaccuum wastegate
> .1996, GM-5, production number 6T-560, GM PN 12552738, die cast compressor
> housing, short turbine housing, new wastegate design
> .1997, GM-8, production number 6T-566, GM PN 12556124, vertical mount
> vaccuum wastegate
> .Hummer, GM-7, production number 6T-561, GM PN 12553949, military
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On 
> Behalf
> Of David Allen
> Sent: Saturday, February 11, 2012 9:13 PM
> To: JY-Turbo List; GM-ECM
> Subject: [Gmecm] Looking for specs - 97 to 99 Chevy diesel 2500HD 
> pickup...
>
> Title says it all. A friend has found a turbo from a 97 to 99 Chevy diesel
> 2500HD pickup. I am afraid it will be way too large for the intended 
> project
> but would appreciate if someone had specs on it.  I'm overseas with very
> limited Internet access to research things like this.
>
> The proect is a 3.8L V6, aiming for 250-300 engine HP. Should require 
> about
> 10 to 12 PSI to do this.
>
> Thanks for any input!
> David
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
>
>
> -----
> No virus found in this message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2112/4805 - Release Date: 02/12/12
>
> 

_______________________________________________
Gmecm mailing list
Gmecm at diy-efi.org
http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://lists.diy-efi.org/pipermail/gmecm/attachments/20120212/cb85ffcf/attachment-0001.html 