DIY_EFI Digest V4 #717

[Daniel Yap]

 to grumpy,
the engine is a Rover K-16 engine.ecu model MKC103730. i was thinking of retarding it by 350 degrees which would give a 10d advance but one cycle slower, i think so anyway. I am just looking at advancing or retarding the delay as I was hoping to keeping everything from the original engine, like the sensor, trigger, ECU unit. I guess it would be easier if i swapped ECU modules or maps. but in case i cant, i was looking at alternatives to that.
to clare
i'm not  too sure whats the output of the reluctance sensor, i assumed that it was in pulses, not a variable voltage, as there are 36 teeth with 2 missing on the wheel. I was not looking for a full ignition module, as i will be trying to keep the stock ECU. but i get the idea for your suggestion. lets say if the output is in pulses, how do i delay the signal by 350d then?
Thanks a lot
Daniel
--

On Sat, 25 Dec 1999 05:00:01   DIY_EFI Digest wrote:
>
>DIY_EFI Digest       Saturday, December 25 1999       Volume 04 : Number 717
>
>
>
>In this issue:
>
>	Re: DIY_EFI Digest V4 #715
>	Re: rpm switch
>	Re: electronic advance
>	Re: DIY_EFI Digest V4 #715
>	TPI and TBI engine swapping book
>
>See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the 
>DIY_EFI or DIY_EFI-Digest mailing lists.
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 14:19:48 -0800
>From: "Daniel Yap" <flor1 at mailcity.com>
>Subject: Re: DIY_EFI Digest V4 #715
>
> hi grumpy, i was thinking of some circuit in between my crankshaft sensor(variable reluctance sensor) and the ECU. Its because the engine will be running on natural gas for a while and the advance for the igntion has to be around 30 degrees for operation. The stock ECU map provides maybe around 14? degrees at idle. I just need to advance the signals by 10 degrees in order for it to run nicely. I'm not too sure whether a MSD timing box will be cost effective as it is a school project and my budget is not all that much. thats why i was thinking of a simple circuit to advance the signals from the crankshaft sensor, the result will be something like moving the sensor around.
>Daniel
>
>
>LYCOShop is now open. On your mark, get set, SHOP!!!
>http://shop.lycos.com/
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 18:19:54 -0500
>From: Braman Wing <braman at braymo.net>
>Subject: Re: rpm switch
>
>The datasheet for the national Semiconductor LM2917 has a couple of examples
>of rpm or frequency based switches. I haven't tried them, but they might point
>you in the right direction. 
>
>
>Braman
>
>> Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 10:24:52 -0500
>> From: scott lelievre <scottl at cape.com>
>> Subject: rpm switch
>> 
>> does anyone have a schematic to make an rpm activated switch? i'd like to
>> make it adjustable if possible.
>> 
>> thanks,
>> scott lelievre
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 18:54:39 -0500
>From: "Clare Snyder" <clare at snyder.on.ca>
>Subject: Re: electronic advance
>
>> From: "Daniel Yap" <flor1 at mailcity.com>
>> Subject: Variable advance for ignition
>>
>> hi, anyone got any success on increasing the advance for ignition
>electronically? Theres no vacuum or static advance on the engine, everything
>is triggered electronically by a variable reluctance sensor. I know that one
>way is to mount the sensor on a slider and shift it but the engine belongs
>to the school and they discourage hacking away at the engine. I looked
>around and think that a all pass opamp or phase shift opamp might solve the
>problem. The diy_efi archives did mention something, Tommy Palm did do
>something like this but his details were a bit sketchy.
>> I was thinking of delaying the signal 350 degrees which would make it 10
>degrees advanced. The main problem is that the phase shift opamp would delay
>from 0 to 180 over a frequency range. I tot of having two together but it
>would give a variation of delay as the engine goes from 500rpm to 5000rpm.
>Any way of having a static advance introduced electronically?
>> Thanks and Merry Xmas
>> Daniel Yap
>>
>The Briggs and Stratton Magnetron has an interesting setup. From the way it
>was explained to me by a B&S tech the "trigger" is designed so that the
>voltage rises faster when the engine turns fater, and the ignition is fired
>when the trigger voltage reaches a given point. At low RPM it takes longer
>for the trigger voltage setpoint to be reached, retarding the timing. At
>High speeds it takes a shorter "time" (number of degrees of crank rotation)
>to reach the setpoint, advancing the timing.
>
>If I was trying to design an electronic timing controller I think I would
>set the maximum advance, and have the system retard the timing inversely to
>speed using a variable delay. A simple circuit that would do this - not
>likely well enough for engine use - would be a 555 timer triggered by the
>pickup and firing the coil X ms later. An integrated inverted pickup signal
>would decrease in voltage with speed increase - connected to the bypass
>terminal of the 555 it would reduce the delay as speed increased. OP Amps
>may be required for scaling and conditioning, but the principal is what I,m
>trying to illustrate.
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Fri, 24 Dec 1999 19:30:36 -0600
>From: nacelp at jclnet.com (CSH-HQ)
>Subject: Re: DIY_EFI Digest V4 #715
>
>I quess you just want to make this difficult?.
>What ecm/eng are you working on?.
>How about just advanciing the timing, and using a retard function?.
>How about a "new" module or kludge wo that rather than using a zero-crossing 
>you had a selectable crossing for trigging a comparator for tripping the oem 
>module?.  Looking ahead 90d is alot more difficult then retarding 10-20.  
>10-20 is also easier then 70.
>  Remember a reluctor can advance or retard the signal as a function of rpm 
>for a few degrees per 1000 rpm.
>Grumpy
>
>
>> hi grumpy, i was thinking of some circuit in between my crankshaft 
>sensor(variable reluctance sensor) and the ECU. Its because the engine will 
>be running on natural gas for a while and the advance for the igntion has to 
>be around 30 degrees for operation. The stock ECU map provides maybe around 
>14? degrees at idle. I just need to advance the signals by 10 degrees in 
>order for it to run nicely. I'm not too sure whether a MSD timing box will 
>be cost effective as it is a school project and my budget is not all that 
>much. thats why i was thinking of a simple circuit to advance the signals 
>from the crankshaft sensor, the result will be something like moving the 
>sensor around.
>>Daniel
>>
>>
>>LYCOShop is now open. On your mark, get set, SHOP!!!
>>http://shop.lycos.com/
>>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Date: Sat, 25 Dec 1999 02:45:28 -0500
>From: Darren Floen <dfloen at tbaytel.net>
>Subject: TPI and TBI engine swapping book
>
>I just bought this book a few weeks ago.It might be helpful in a few
>areas,but i found that it lacks alot of information.I'm in the process
>of swapping a 4.3 TBI engine into my Toyota 4x4.There is VERY little
>info on anything TBI in this book.It deals pretty much only wih TPI.
>
>Not worth the money,in my opinion.
>
>
>> From: Nicholas McIntosh <njmac at us.net>
>> Subject: GM TBI on AMC 258
>> 
>> Hello
>> i have been told to get a book called TBI AND TPI ENGINE SWAPPING.  i
>> have not purchased it yet.  do you think this is a good book for me to
>> read?  will it have information pertinate to my situation?  i am also
>> going to get the manual for a chevy pickup 4.3 and see what i can
>- -- 
>Darren Floen
>Thunderbay,Ontario
>85 Toyota  Xtra cab 4x4
>5" custom YJ/Mazda lift,4.3,TH350,5.29's,Detroit rear,True-Trac
>front,and lotsa other stuff...
>
>------------------------------
>
>End of DIY_EFI Digest V4 #717
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