DIYEFI: DIY_EFI Digest V5 #226

[DIY_EFI Digest]

DIY_EFI Digest         Thursday, June 22 2000         Volume 05 : Number 226



In this issue:

	Re: gm altenators...and efi
	Re: gm altenators...and efi
	Re: Multi Coil Setups
	79 Z-28 EFI
	Ignition cuts for rev limits / traction control
	Re: 79 Z-28 EFI

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Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:08:24 -0400
From: Shannen Durphey <shannen at grolen.com>
Subject: Re: gm altenators...and efi

$2,400 Canadian! : )

My favorite application for an older SI type alternator is an 85 or 86
Olds Cutlass Calais with 3.0 or 3.3 liter (I can't remember which)
engine and a/c.  They're rated for something like 120 Amps, and are
mostly heavy duty inside.  If you're really creative you can get them
out of the core pile at your local parts store.  

The CS style alternators were prone to failures in trucks.  The
bearings would sieze, and the rotors would eventually fall out of the
front of the alternator.  I've seen radiators broken, failed trans's,
accessory mountings broken, and 2 fires started because of these hp
savin' units.  I don't think the situation's changed much, I just
don't work on trucks as often as I used to.  But if I had a car which
needed a CS alternator, I'd look into getting the "iceberg" brand rear
cover and associated parts.  Supposed to be better cooling, larger
bearings, yadda yadda.  Everything the "go faster" guy could want in
an alternator. : )

Shannen


Is it true Doc wanted to launder money in Canada, since it was worth
so much more there?



Bruce Plecan wrote:
> 
> I *think* yours is similiar to the one I had in my 84 F-body, I took it to a
> good local altern shop and they changed the guts of it, and walked out with
> a 108 for like $40US, or about $2,400 Can..
> 
> > Well on my way home last night I notice my signl lights were slow to
> flash..
> > then glancing over at the factory volt gauge, it was at 8..
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Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 20:29:15 -0400
From: "Bruce Plecan" <nacelp at bright.net>
Subject: Re: gm altenators...and efi

Was doing inventory control for the local parts house for a while, and we
sold them like 4 to 1 overall to all others (ford, mopar, etc). was
ridiculous

> $2,400 Canadian! : )
> My favorite application for an older SI type alternator is an 85 or 86
> Olds Cutlass Calais with 3.0 or 3.3 liter (I can't remember which)
> engine and a/c.  They're rated for something like 120 Amps, and are
> mostly heavy duty inside.  If you're really creative you can get them
> out of the core pile at your local parts store.
> The CS style alternators were prone to failures in trucks.  The
> bearings would sieze, and the rotors would eventually fall out of the
> front of the alternator.  I've seen radiators broken, failed trans's,
> accessory mountings broken, and 2 fires started because of these hp
> savin' units.  I don't think the situation's changed much, I just
> don't work on trucks as often as I used to.  But if I had a car which
> needed a CS alternator, I'd look into getting the "iceberg" brand rear
> cover and associated parts.  Supposed to be better cooling, larger
> bearings, yadda yadda.  Everything the "go faster" guy could want in
> an alternator. : )
> Shannen
> Is it true Doc wanted to launder money in Canada, since it was worth
> so much more there?

Ya, and that was a disaster, wasted alot of time ironing.
Grumpy

> Bruce Plecan wrote:
> > I *think* yours is similiar to the one I had in my 84 F-body, I took it
to a
> > good local altern shop and they changed the guts of it, and walked out
with
> > a 108 for like $40US, or about $2,400 Can..
> > > Well on my way home last night I notice my signl lights were slow to
> > flash..
> > > then glancing over at the factory volt gauge, it was at 8..


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Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 21:49:48 -0700 (PDT)
From: Orin <orin>
Subject: Re: Multi Coil Setups

> Check out the smart coils used on the late GMs, they have all the
> electronics in them, and just need the fire signal. Orin posted about the
> "operation" of them.  They have an auto shut off.

Yes, I'll dig out the info again...

Leaving them armed isn't safe at very low RPM.  They will fire after
1/10 second of being armed whether you tell them to fire or not.

As I recall, over 2.7V on the fire input arms them, then
grounding it fires them.  Ie you don't need much more than
an opto-isolator and a resistor to drive them.

Orin.
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Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 02:35:06 -0500
From: sapearso at collins.rockwell.com
Subject: 79 Z-28 EFI

Here's my background, maybe this will help in your recommendations. I'm
currently an electronics engineering student and for the past 10 years have
been an auto technician. I'm familiar with the diagnosis and repair of fuel
injection systems, but I've never tried to build one of my own. So I figure
now is the time to start. I'm not in a big hurry to get this done, planning
on the car being down for a year or two to do the rest of the work on it
anyway.

I look forward to any ideas you might have.

Scott

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Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 10:08:45 +0100
From: "Murphy, Ian" <Ian.Murphy at Arrows.com>
Subject: Ignition cuts for rev limits / traction control

Does anyone have any cunning ideas for implementing ignition cut strategies
for rev limits and traction control purposes?

I'm struggling with the following concern: You detect an over-rev (or
wheelspin) event and want to cut spark ASAP, but the coil driver(s) are
already charging the coil(s) for the next combustion event (or 2, or 3,
depending on your system). Do you wait until the next available 'slot' when
you can avoid charging a coil up (and therefore possibly risk over-reving
further) or can you 'bleed down' the charging coils somehow without causing
a spark to fire?

The only other solution that springs to mind is retarding the already
charging coils to limit torque output while waiting for the cut to be
available.

Another thing that bothers me is engine stalling: If you stall an engine,
and have a charging coil, what do you do with the spark? If you just fire it
off after the maximum safe dwell for your coil, the engine could be in any
position and you could blow up your inlet manifold, or push the engine
backwards...

Any thoughts?

Ian
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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 07:06:07 -0400
From: Shannen Durphey <shannen at grolen.com>
Subject: Re: 79 Z-28 EFI

Well, you still didn't mention what you want. : )  So I'll throw the
ball back to you.  The easiest thing to do is get an efi system from a
junkyard car.  You'll be able to get all the lines, brackets,
incidentals that you'll need.  Throttle body is the easiest, tuned
port is a little tougher, and an OBDII compatible system would
probably be the toughest.  For a first time conversion, to get a taste
of efi, a tbi swap using a 1227747 ecm is probably the way to go.  But
there's no real rule for this.  Look through the archives located at
ftp://diy-efi.org/incoming/ and you'll see plenty of info about chip
reprogramming, efi swapping, and more.

There's tons of stuff on the web, ya just gotta decide how much work
you want to invest and what the point is, ie driving the car or being
able to say "I built the whole danged thing meself."

Shannen

sapearso at collins.rockwell.com wrote:
> 
> Here's my background, maybe this will help in your recommendations. I'm
> currently an electronics engineering student and for the past 10 years have
> been an auto technician. I'm familiar with the diagnosis and repair of fuel
> injection systems, but I've never tried to build one of my own. So I figure
> now is the time to start. I'm not in a big hurry to get this done, planning
> on the car being down for a year or two to do the rest of the work on it
> anyway.
> 
> I look forward to any ideas you might have.
> 
> Scott
> 
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