[Diy_efi] Re: +AFs-Diy+AF8-efi+AF0- Reality check - no efi content - long winded

[David Allen]

Oh, and I hope you did NOT pay that bill+ACE-

----- Original Message ----- 
From: +ACI-Bill - Comcast+ACI- +ADw-b.shaw+AEA-comcast.net+AD4-
To: +ADw-diy+AF8-efi+AEA-diy-efi.org+AD4-
Sent: Saturday, August 19, 2006 6:52 PM
Subject: +AFs-Diy+AF8-efi+AF0- Reality check - no efi content - long winded


+AD4- Sorry for the off topic post but I know there's a lot of mechanical 
+AD4- knowledge here and thought I'd solicit some opinions on this situation. 
+AD4- 
+AD4- We just returned from the vacation-from-hell.  Amy's wagon ate the 
+AD4- timing chain in upstate NY.  We got towed into a garage where they 
+AD4- quoted 4-5 hours labor,  +ACQ-450 to +ACQ-500 to fix it.  They stumbled and 
+AD4- bumbled around with it for 3 days (each time I asked they were almost 
+AD4- done,  only a couple more hours) while we waited and finally at about 
+AD4- 5:30 on the third day they started it,  but it ran like garbage and was 
+AD4- leaking antifreeze from around the water pump and had a major oil leak 
+AD4- from the valve cover.  They fiddled with the plug wires for 2 more hours 
+AD4- before they finally gave up and pushed it out of the bay and into the 
+AD4- yard.  They went home to supper and left me, Amy,  and the 2 kids (7 +ACY- 
+AD4- 4) sitting in the car for 5 hours waiting for my car hauler to be 
+AD4- brought up from CT. 
+AD4- 
+AD4- Oh yes,  before they went home they handed me a bill for +ACQ-1050.  The 
+AD4- bill lists a tow (+ACQ-27),  parts (+ACQ-180) and the remainder labor:  replaced 
+AD4- the timing chain +ACY- gears,  clean debris from the oil pan, and R+ACY-R valve 
+AD4- covers for the compression test.  The owner feels perfectly justified in 
+AD4- the 2X bill,  didn't know he had to clean the oil pan when he gave the 
+AD4- estimate,  didn't include the compression test (+ACY- valve covers) in the 
+AD4- estimate.
+AD4- 
+AD4- Some questions for the gang:
+AD4- 
+AD4- 1) Is the 1988 Buick 3.8L V6 an interference engine?  What are the 
+AD4- chances we bent a valve?
+AD4- 
+AD4- 2) They did a compression check before doing the work and said all 6 
+AD4- holes were 120 to 140.  They had to pull the valve covers and loosened 
+AD4- the rockers since the cam wasn't turning.  I can't imagine how this is a 
+AD4- valid test since the valves didn't open on the suck cycle.  Is there any 
+AD4- way this could have been a valid compression test?
+AD4- 
+AD4- 3)  I did a compression test this afternoon (cam's turning now :-) ),  
+AD4- I've got 30 psi in hole +ACM-1, 90 in +ACM-3,  and about 120 in the others.  
+AD4- Squirted oil in +ACM-1 and retested... still 30.  I pulled the valve cover 
+AD4- to try to fix the oil leak and while it was off I removed the 2 rockers 
+AD4- on +ACM-1 and retested... still 30 psi.
+AD4- 
+AD4- 4)  They spent 3.5 to 4 hours trying to remove the oil pan to clean the 
+AD4- debris out of it (billed me for 4.3 hours).  Is this reasonable for a 
+AD4- Buick Century wagon?  Seems to me there should have been another way 
+AD4- other than removing all the stuff they did.
+AD4- 
+AD4- 5) Is there any way to check cam timing without  taking the timing cover 
+AD4- (+ACY- water pump) off? 
+AD4- 
+AD4- I did some other checks too - all injectors are firing,  I have spark in 
+AD4- all 6.  I'm thinking either a valve is bent in +ACM-1 or the cam timing is 
+AD4- off.  Any thoughts would be appreciated,  my apologies again for the off 
+AD4- topic post.
+AD4- 
+AD4- Best,
+AD4- 
+AD4- Bill
+AD4- 
+AD4- 
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