[Diy_efi] Is E85 worth it?

[Daniel Nicoson]

Ethanol absorbs too much water and ends up being pretty corrosive in
pipelines.  If you read up on what the ethanol camp has to say, they claim
to have improved the energy exchange in production so that it is a positive
process.

Personally I think ethanol is a transitional fuel and will eventually be
replaced by butanol as the long term replacement for a percentage of
gasoline.  There is a modified fermentation process being finalized by
several research groups that can make butanol from biomas as opposed to
needing high cost grain.  BP & Dupont are pursuing this technology in the
UK.  The beauty of butanol is that it has very similar characteristics to
typical gasoline; doesn't absorb much water, about 90% the energy content
per gallon as gasoline, high octane rating (I think 94 or so?) and can be
used within the existing pipeline-tank infrastructure without modification.
Currently only available as an industrial solvent derived from oil, butanol
will have to be made from any of the various biomass sources to be viable.

Whatever wins long term market acceptance I would rather make some
Midwestern farmer and his agro-industry marketing chain wealthy than keep
supplying oil dollars to nations and people that don't like us.

I don't think we will ever get away from oil entirely in our lifetime but we
can certainly change how much we get from where by using some of these
alternatives.

Bottom line, the market will determine...

Dan Nicoson

-----Original Message-----
From: diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org]On
Behalf Of Frederick Trient
Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 2:26 PM
To: diy_efi at diy-efi.org
Subject: Re: [Diy_efi] Is E85 worth it?

This "pipeline" factor is new to me. Why can't ethanol be piped?
Could it be if pre-mixed with petro?

I don't see much mention in this thread of the geo-political
ramifications of using greater and greater amounts of ethanol. For
me, on balance, the upside is that less and less $ goes to petro
producing countries that turn around and funnel some of that wealth
into Islamic extremist organizations. Saudi Arabia and Iran are prime
examples.

Fred


On Aug 25, 2006, at 7:28 AM, Steve Ravet wrote
> Farming is petroleum intensive work, with diesel fuel for equipment,
> petroleum based fertilizers and pesticides.  Then add the fact that
> ethanol can't go in a pipeline and has to be hauled everywhere by
> truck.
> If you have to burn a gallon of diesel to make and transport a
> gallon of
> ethanol then it's not very "hydrocarbon effective" either.  E85 is
> about
> corporate welfare, and farming welfare queens.
>
> --steve

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