[Efi332] Where can I find info about 4 layer board

Mon Apr 17 17:33:31 UTC 2006

Darrin,

The current design was offered as a group buy more than 5 years ago and has
met with limited success. Only a few systems were completed, and I
know of only 2 in current use. Although there are many reasons for this, the
main one was the combination of difficult hurdles one had to overcome. There
was/is little documentation and due to the complexity, it required a high 
degree of skill and perseverance to complete. 

Designing a system of this capability is a daunting task, documenting the 
design to the point where the common enthusiast can work with it is another 
thing entirely. The difference between the failure of efi332 and the success 
of megasquirt is mainly the lowering of the bar with MS. The simplicity of 
MS has given more folks the chance can be successful and these folks have 
in turn contributed mountains of documentation which has entrailed more folks 
etc etc. efi332 was difficult enough that it never quite "caught" despite 
being a basically sound design. Apparently some folks are still a little 
bitter about this.

The board design itself has been proven to be very reliable when properly 
assembled. The board is large but is no more fragile than any other design. 
The main drawbacks are the need for external drivers, and the size/configuration
leads to some issues with enclosures and connectors. Many folks did have 
problems with the group buy boards, but these generally stemmed primarily from ham
fisted assembly. I have seen more of these boards than anyone else and this 
is the overwhelming problem with them. At the time of the group buy, one 
guy was doing assembly and it is these units that had the highest dropout rate. 

In any event, there are lots of boards out there, and many of them are sound.
There are probably some folks who would like to sell if you're looking to buy.
Like Andrei says though, you need to be competent at assembly, building your
own cross-tools, programming, and integrating an entire system. Although there 
is always help via the list, its largely up to you to make it go.

There are follow on designs out there too. Megasquirt is one. Its got basic 
capability, and as a result, a huge user base with good support. However, as you 
get into more complex systems, you run into the same problems that hurt efi332. 
My MPC555 based design is in this camp. Although fully functional, its relatively
expensive and complex. Until some documentation is built up, it requires many of 
the same skills that efi332 does. Such is the nature of these systems.

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Andrei Chichak <andreic at chichak.ca>
>To: efi332 at diy-efi.org
>Sent: Sun, 16 Apr 2006 23:08:31 -0600
>Subject: Re: [Efi332] Where can I find info about 4 layer board
>
>
>At 05:58 PM 4/16/2006, you wrote: 
>>Are these still available, if so what TPU mask do they have? 
> 
>The 4 layer board was only produced once, way back before the list had a problem 
>with a mouthy troll and a server crash. There was also a situation, where a well 
>meaning person, through an unfortunate set of circumstances had some major 
>components go missing and a LOT of the 4 layer sets never got built. 
> 
>Frankly, at 8" x 8" it was a very large, fragile board. The people that have 
>them running will swear that the boards are fine (they are also the people 
>flogging the mega-squirt system). 
> 
>If you put out a request, you might find someone to sell you a complete or 
>partial set. You had better be good at soldering, putting together programming 
>tools, designing code, and be relatively self supporting. 
> 
>There are about 4 different TPU code sets available; the standard automotive 
>set as it resides in ROM, the automotive set in assembleable microcode, the 
>BMW set, and the one that you can easily put together to do the functions 
>you need from the publicly available microcode. 
> 
>Remember that the microcode set is dependant on the processor that you order. 
>You can get either set from Freescale. The processor is in a socket (!) and either fit. 
> 
>I have done a brain dump on a whole bunch of info on my web site. Some of it 
>is specific to my project, but there is a bunch of general stuff there as well. 
>See: http://www.chichak.ca:8080 for more info. 
> 
>>Where can I find more detailed info? 
> 
>On several occasions the list daddys were asked for some information/documentation/hints
>...well apparently if a job is hard to do, it should be hard to understand. 
> 
>I have put a bunch of docs on my web pages in the references section, a good overview 
>of the whole project is the section called
> "<http://www.chichak.ca/EFIsupport/TPUPN15B.pdf>
> Period Measurement With Missing Transition Detection TPU Function (PMM)". 
> 
>Motorola/Freescale has put out a LOT of data sheets on every part of the processor 
>and it is a hell of a lot of information to take in. Please feel free to ask. 
> 
>>Thanks. 
>>Darrin Garrett 
> 
>Andrei 
> 
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