Question about WOT table in $8D bin

[Bruce Plecan]

----- Original Message -----
From: "Len Sabatine" <sabatine at epix.net>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2000 6:00 PM
Subject: Re: Question about WOT table in $8D bin


>     Really ? I managed to run high 11s with '95 Lt1 GM Stock Spark and
Fuel
> calibrations.
>      A4 , NA.
>     Len
>
> >Stock curves suck...    I used the curves from a chip designed for a ZZ4
and
> >I gained almost 4 tenths and 4 miles per hour in the 1/4 mile. Oh well...
I
> >guess I'll just play with I got. Thanx anyway
> >
> >p.s. it's Edmond by the way
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: <timsiford at hushmail.com>
> >To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
> >Sent: Friday, November 17, 2000 11:10 AM
> >Subject: Re: Question about WOT table in $8D bin
> >
> >
> >| Edmund,
> >|
> >| Using my base curves would not be advised.  I recommend beginning with
a
> >| stock base curve.  Why you ask?  My MiniRam intake, AFR heads, bigger
> >exhaust,
> >|  and 112LSA make my VE curves significantly different from stock ...
MUCH
> >| more so than yours.  Your curves will be more similar to the stock
curves
> >| due to the intake style, the heads, and the exhaust that you are
running.
> >|  Not just pulling a 'not sharing' on this one.  You REALLY will be
closer
> >| to the stock curves than my curves.
> >|
> >| Tim
> >|
> >| At Fri, 17 Nov 2000 10:07:07 -0800, "NRGZ28" <euro at lvcm.com> wrote:
> >|
> >| >
> >| >Tim, would you be so kind to show what your VE (ext) table values are
> >| >from
> >| >90-100 kpa ? I got the same cam as you and I'd to at least get a base
> >| >to
> >| >start from when I tune for WOT.
> >| >
> >| >----- Original Message -----
> >| >From: <timsiford at hushmail.com>
> >| >To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
> >| >Sent: Friday, November 17, 2000 7:02 AM
> >| >Subject: Re: Question about WOT table in $8D bin
> >| >
> >| >
> >| >> Bob,
> >| >>
> >| >> Using the equation that you extracted from the ANHT hac and plugging
> >| >in
> >| >> my values for 5600RPMs and 80deg C I get ...
> >| >> 6553.6 / ((149 + 58 + 128) * 445) / 256) = 11.25
> >| >>
> >| >> HOORAY!!!!  This is exactly what diacom reports for my setup in this
> >| >range.
> >| >>  This is definitely the formula to utilize.  NEWBIE NOTE: the value
> >| >149
> >| >> was retrieved through a hex editor (Hex Workshop).  Simply using the
> >| >values
> >| >> in TC will not work.
> >| >>
> >| >> Tim
> >| >>
> >| >>
> >| >> At Thu, 16 Nov 2000 17:46:00 -0500, rr <RRauscher at nni.com> wrote:
> >| >>
> >| >> >
> >| >> >
> >| >> >Umm, I just checked the anht hac, and I can't get the equation
quoted
> >| >> >below to give me the same answers as the code.
> >| >> >
> >| >> >Using tables L860D & L8617 @ 80c & 6400rpm, I get an AFR of
> >| >> >11.6:1. Here is the equation using the raw bin values:
> >| >> >
> >| >> >WOT AFR = 6553.6 / ((TBL L8617 + TBL L860D + 128) * 445) / 256)
> >| >> >
> >| >> >w/vals:
> >| >> >
> >| >> >11.6 = 6553.6 / ((138 + 58 + 128) * 445) / 256)
> >| >> >
> >| >> >This is right from the hac and matches the code (I corrected the
> >| >one
> >| >> >table
> >| >> >address in the equation). What are the AFR's when using this
equation?
> >| >> >
> >| >> >Thanks,
> >| >> >
> >| >> >BobR.
> >| >> >
> >| >> >
> >| >> >JN wrote:
> >| >> >
> >| >> >> Wow, in looking at my bin that was modified by a reputable tuner
> >| >originally,
> >| >> >> he has what I calc as a 14.12 AFR at 5200 and a 14.85 at 5600!
> >| > I
> >| >> >guess with
> >| >> >> the miniram I should fatten these up some.  Tim, what do you have
> >| >> >for PE vs
> >| >> >> RPM.  Our motors are similar cams, intake and we both run 30
pound
> >| >> >injectors
> >| >> >> with a 33 pound injector constant.
> >| >> >>
> >| >> >> Jason
> >| >> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >| >> >> From: <timsiford at hushmail.com>
> >| >> >> To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
> >| >> >> Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2000 4:04 PM
> >| >> >> Subject: Re: Question about WOT table in $8D bin
> >| >> >>
> >| >> >> > Bruce,
> >| >> >> >
> >| >> >> > I don't think its as bad as what you are saying.  Please - hear
> >| >> >me out.
> >| >> >> >  I said that the calculation shows that I am running 10.16 AFR.
> >| >> > This was
> >| >> >> > at 5600rpms and a coolant temp of 80deg C.  HOWEVER, the stock
> >| >AUJP
> >| >> >bin
> >| >> >> > has a PE modifier of 7.8 at 4000rpms in WOT %Change in AFR vs
> >| >RPM
> >| >> >and a
> >| >> >> > modifier of 22.7 in WOT %Change in AFR vs Coolant.  This
results
> >| >> >in a
> >| >> >> 10.22
> >| >> >> > AFR.
> >| >> >> >
> >| >> >> > Now, I am NOT running 10.16 everywhere.  I just picked the
highest
> >| >> >point
> >| >> >> > of the curve and reported that point.  I also picked the
highest
> >| >> >point of
> >| >> >> > the AUJP curve and reported that.  Again, the formula I am
using
> >| >> >is the
> >| >> >> > one previously supplied here on the list ....
> >| >> >> >
> >| >> >> > ( 1  -  (( RPM Mod  +  Coolant Mod )  /  100 )  *  14.7
> >| >> >> >
> >| >> >> > I am not concerned about the fueling.  I am close to 128 at all
> >| >> >points
> >| >> >> when
> >| >> >> > driving.  I spent significant time on the VE curves.  The WOT
> >| >%Change
> >| >> >to
> >| >> >> > AFR tables are modified from stock ... but, no so much in the
> >| >levels
> >| >> >but
> >| >> >> > more as to the shape.  The MiniRam doesn't need as much fuel
> >| >at
> >| >> >4000RPMs
> >| >> >> > as compared to the TPI.  However, it does need more at
5600rpms.
> >| >> >> >
> >| >> >> > Tim
> >| >> >> >
> >| >> >> > At Wed, 15 Nov 2000 12:28:20 -0500, "Bruce Plecan"
> >| ><nacelp at bright.net>
> >| >> >> wrote:
> >| >> >> >
> >| >> >> > >
> >| >> >> > >
> >| >> >> > >IMO,
> >| >> >> > >Your running a diesel now.
> >| >> >> > >You have enough fuel that your CR is even up.
> >| >> >> > >At tear down the ring lands will be knocked out and you'll
need
> >| >> >pistons.
> >| >> >> > >Just about beat you have a 160d and within one heat range of
> >| >stock
> >| >> >plugs.
> >| >> >> > >The tip of the plug is acting like a glow plug for lighting
> >| >the
> >| >> >change.
> >| >> >> > >It kinda a typical thing when your at more fuel more timing
> >| >agenda
> >| >> >stuff,
> >| >> >> > >just some guys go that route wastes gas, and tough on parts
> >| >IMO.
> >| >> >> > >No telling what the heads will be like, if (oem) iron probably
> >| >> >cracked
> >| >> >> > >between the seats.
> >| >> >> > >Also, will have more carbon to deal with and more likely to
> >| >burn
> >| >> >an
> >| >> >> > >exhuast
> >| >> >> > >valve.
> >| >> >> > >It's like doing a nitro tune but with gas, eats parts
> >| >> >> > >Bruce
> >| >> >> > >
> >| >> >> > >
> >| >> >> > >> >Just remember you said that <g>
> >| >> >> > >>
> >| >> >> > >> I'll remember Bruce <g>.  But, I'm not a fluke.  I've talked
> >| >> >to several
> >| >> >> > >> other AFR190/MiniRam ownders that are running the same type
> >| >of
> >| >> >spark
> >| >> >> > >advance
> >| >> >> > >> (max).  Now sure about the Air/Fuel ratio they are running
> >| >though.
> >| >> >> > > Will
> >| >> >> > >> be pulling plugs soon to take a gander.
> >| >> >> > >>
> >| >> >> > >> Curious though .... I have a feeling that you think I'm
gonna
> >| >> >blow
> >| >> >> > >myself
> >| >> >> > >> up :-)  Can I pick your mind and ask why?  I know that I
will
> >| >> >> eventually
> >| >> >> > >> lose the bottom end ... but, I don't think that it will be
> >| >PROM
> >| >> >> related.
> >| >> >> > >>
> >| >> >> > >> Tim
> >| >> >
> >| >> >-----------------------------------------------------------------
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> >| >efi.org
> >| >> >
> >| >
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