[Diy_efi] Peak cylinder pressure timing

Hugh Keir hugh at sol.co.uk
Thu Mar 6 18:13:56 GMT 2003


Brian,

Here is a link that might help http://www.pcb.com/tech_pres.html

Also do a Google search for cylinder pressure based engine control and you
should pull up a printout of SPE paper 2000-01-0932.

The full title is :

Cylinder-Pressure-Based Engine Control Using
Pressure-Ratio-Management and Low_Cost
Non-Intrusive Cylinder Pressure Sensors

It is repreinted from Electronic Engine Controls 2000: Controls (SP-1500)
Hugh

----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Michalk" <michalk at awpi.com>
To: "List for general do-it-yourself EFI talk" <diy_efi at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 4:41 AM
Subject: RE: [Diy_efi] Peak cylinder pressure timing


> Thanks.  It helps a little, but I was really hoping to get a better handle
> on the piezo crystal.
>
>  Brian Michalk  <http://www.michalk.com>
> Life is what you make of it ... never wish you had done something.
> Aviator, experimental aircraft builder, motorcyclist, SCUBA diver
> musician, home-brewer, entrepreneur and mostly single
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org]On
> > Behalf Of Hugh Keir
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 3:17 PM
> > To: List for general do-it-yourself EFI talk
> > Subject: Re: [Diy_efi] Peak cylinder pressure timing
> >
> >
> > Brian,
> >
> > This should take you to a Daimler Benz 1983 patent
> >
> > http://l2.espacenet.com/espacenet/bnsviewer?CY=gb&LG=en&DB=EPD&PN=
> > DE3130238I
> > D=DE+++3130238A1+I+
> >  or the above line is too long,
> > http://l2.espacenet.com/espacenet/viewer?PN=DE3130238&CY=gb&LG=en&DB=EPD
> >
> > 1938 patent
> > http://w3p.espacenet.com/espacenet/viewer?PN=DE656168&CY=gb&LG=en&DB=EPD
> >
> > Click drawing
> >
> > 1972 Patent
> > http://w3p.espacenet.com/espacenet/bnsviewer?CY=gb&LG=en&DB=EPD&PN
> > =CA908745&
> > ID=CA++++908745A1+I+
> >
> > Click drawing and look at figure 3 bottom of the page
> >
> > All of the above links are long and may loose some of their
> > length with the
> > word wrap, so add the characters on the wrapped line back in.
> >
> > There are loads more like the above, although the first one is more like
> > what I had in mind.
> >
> > Hugh
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Brian Michalk" <michalk at awpi.com>
> > To: "List for general do-it-yourself EFI talk" <diy_efi at diy-efi.org>
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 9:12 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Diy_efi] Peak cylinder pressure timing
> >
> >
> > > I am very interested.
> > > What do you mean by the top of the housing?  Is the crystal inside the
> > > combustion chamber?
> > > Do you have any references?
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org
> > [mailto:diy_efi-bounces at diy-efi.org]On
> > > > Behalf Of Hugh Keir
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 2:27 PM
> > > > To: List for general do-it-yourself EFI talk
> > > > Subject: [Diy_efi] Peak cylinder pressure timing
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > There are a number of patents, some going back over 20 years
covering
> > the
> > > > use of piezo crystals that use the spark plug ceramic as a piston to
> > > > compress the piezo crystal against the top of the spark plug
> > housing and
> > > > allow you to read the cylinder pressure.
> > > >
> > > > There do not appear to be any systems in the marketplace that
> > > > take advantage
> > > > of this system for peak cylinder pressure readout.
> > > >
> > > > Optrand and Kistler make some more advanced systems that are
> > US$3000 per
> > > > spark plug - hardly suitable for the hobbyist.
> > > >
> > > > Having spoken to a piezo manufacturer, it appears that there are
> > crystals
> > > > that will give a good response and should stand the heat found at
> > > > the top of
> > > > the spark plug housing. Does anyone have any thoughts on why
> > this is not
> > > > do-able for the timing of peak cylinder pressure.
> > > >
> > > > 8000 RPM = 48,000 degrees crank rotation per second which should
> > > > be readable
> > > > to something close to 1 degree with a decent processor clock
> > speed and a
> > > > simple bit of averaging, compare it to the crank trigger and
> > display the
> > > > figure.
> > > >
> > > > Stands back and waits to be shot down!
> > > >
> > > > Hugh
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
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> > > >
> > >
> > >
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>
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